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'Bad math': Airlines' COVID safety analysis challenged by expert

A campaign by coronavirus-stricken aviation giants to persuade the world it’s safe to fly has been questioned by one of the scientists whose research it draws upon. ( More...

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Let doctors and virologists do independent research about safety about cabin air samples randomly
Silent Bob 7
How though? Are doctors gonna run up and down the aisle on random flights waving containers around to collect air samples? In order to get a valid result from a test you need repeatable conditions and a control to establish a baseline.

It’s funny how people will blindly follow “science” when it supports their perspective, but when it challenges it they all of a sudden need more testing or further proof, or if they really don’t want to accept it just attack it as “junk science”.
WhiteKnight77 3
Exactly. If one cannot get a repeated result using the same method, or different methods, then is the original result accurate? At least the United/Boeing test tries to show such, but just that one test is not enough. Similar and enhanced (more dummies emitting aerosols or mists) tests are needed to see if the results are the same, or if something else happens.
Pete Schecter 13
The DOD study recently completed does a really good job of identifying and examining airborne particle spread thru cabin air ion both narrow and wide body aircraft.

Based on this very subjective and granular data, 45 hours of continuous flight time is required to obtain a particle load consistent with infectious transmission (via airborne particles).

This report is worth a read, and has a lot of good data in it, and the methodology is solid, using measures of particles for modeling the dispersion of chem-bio hazards.
Greg S 7
I expect airline's Covid safety assertions to be self-serving, but that was not much of a 'challenge' by that particular expert. Citing known infections is not bad math, it's just a limitation that's shared by all testing for all diseases, ever. There has been some analysis of the total prevalence of Covid-19 in a population compared to the number of positive Covid tests. While it seems to vary somewhat, a factor of 10 to 1 is a decent ballpark figure. That would put the estimate of the number of infected airline passengers at 450-500 out of 1.2 billion, which means the IATA statement is still reasonable.
bbabis 13
Long after covid is gone many other infectious respiratory ailments that have always been with us will still be with us. They're not in the news and serve no political purpose so they are no big deal to travelers. As has always been the case, the elderly and compromised among us must always be vigilant during travel and others vigilant of them.
And nobody seems to talk about the associated close contact necessities of airline travel. Sitting in a departure lounge, lining up at check in, etc.
jrollf 3
I find it interesting that they concentration on "airborne" but completely avoid the physical contact aspect. Someone sitting next to you that is sick, likely has the virus on their hands... and then transfer to everything they touch, arm-rests, tray tables, seat, bathroom, etc... Then other passengers will touch these items and potentially get infected. No amount of airflow will prevent that.
David Stark -9
Except that the virus does not survive more than a few seconds on a surface.
jrollf 4
Not true, it can last for a long time...

WebMD: "The coronavirus can live for hours to days on surfaces like countertops and doorknobs. How long it survives depends on the material the surface is made from."

CBS News siting a study: " The scientists found that at 68 degrees Fahrenheit, SARS-CoV-2 was "extremely robust" on smooth surfaces — like cell phone and other touch screens — surviving for 28 days on glass, steel and plastic banknotes.

At 86 degrees Fahrenheit, the survival rate dropped to seven days and plunged to just 24 hours at 104 degrees Fahrenheit."

So yes, COVID-19 infection from surfaces that have been touched is a major concern. The airlines themselves say the "disinfect the planes EVERY NIGHT", so plenty of time for an infection to spread.
David Stark 1
Not credible sources. WebMD = CBS News, well...
jrollf 3
CBS sighted studies by Australia's national science agency, Kyoto Prefectural University of Medicine in Japan, with data published or Oxford's Jourunal of Infections Diseases.

So, you can either follow the research, or believe BS politicians and Facebook. Your choice.

Provide a credible source that the "virus does not survive more than a few seconds on a surface". At the moment, your claim is baseless, it is well known for decades that most flew like virus, which COVID-19 is, can survive on surfaces, and are generally easily transferred by touch. I've provided multiple references, you provided none.
sparkie624 -1
I believe after the election that there will be a large Decline in the Virus!.... LOL... But of course.. as I said before... 4 More Years of Trump the Very Dims won't give up and have it for 4 more years... Biden Wins, be gone by the first of the year... Which is worse... The Virus or Biden.. LOL!
sparkie624 0
Just sick and tired about hearing about Corvid.... Much of it being Political.
Randy Marco 0
Ignorance is bliss, you are emblematic of what's wrong with this country.
Spin Wing 4
Ignorant? Or just refuses to be gullible?
I’m going with option two.
Sholto Brown 0
darjr26 0
I’m sick and tired of people like you.
bbabis 3
No need for that here. Keep it in the hanger.
darjr26 1
I’m tired of self serving narcissists trying to minimize a serious virus that has killed almost 250k people, including four that I know. One friend has lost both of his parents. My sister is a nurse and most nights comes home exhausted. Go to a major hospital’s COVID floor and tell the doctors and nurses how “tired” you are of COVID. Tell them it’s all political. Go visit a family that had to say goodbye to a loved one via FaceTime because they are not allowed to be with them when they expire. You can keep it in the hangar, I can’t anymore.
Ed Crist 2
I agree. It is amazing how many people live in a vacuum. They refuse to believe what they see or hear. These are the same people who believe the dear Leader is doing a fantastic job; and he is, right down into the gutter.
David Stark 0
I refuse to believe what I see or hear from the news media. There is an agenda at work and it is not aided by truthful or accurate reporting.
WhiteKnight77 0
That is due to how media works. Those who do not believe that the media has an agenda needs to reexamine how they look at things. This is a telling article.
More garbage from “scientists”.
Spin Wing -6
Of those infected while flying on an airliner, how many passed away?
Since they’re not even reporting that, I’ll make the assumption that not many did, if any at all.
Which makes this entire thing a great big “SO WHAT?!!!”
Sholto Brown 0
Yep...agree 100%
Spin Wing 2
Shoutout, seems there are not a lot who do agree.
Cancel culture is rife.
Too bad, I guess.
Spin Wing 2
I do hate autocorrect!!!
sparkie624 2
:) - I have had them to mess up my post more than once.. LOL
David Stark -8
Practically everyone in (political) authority has been lying about COVID-19 from the beginning.
sparkie624 -2
What do you expect.... On an Election year and you expect to hear the "Truth"

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

devmegsmum 4
So you think the ENTIRE world is conspiring to make up a phoney virus? To what end? Give your head a shake man. The virus is real and you are in a mass of denial.
David Stark -1
The virus is real. The global response is driven by deliberate misinformation.
sparkie624 0
Not denying it is not real... It has just become too political and people are getting too pushy about it. I also do not feel it is as bad as everyone is making it out to be.
sparkie624 -7
I have said quite a few times... If Biden Wins it will be over by the first of the year, if Trump Wins, the Dim's will keep pedaling for the next 4 years!
Spin Wing 0
True dat!!!

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

braxtron 12
PCR tests are not unreliable or prone to false results (I am a PhD who is active in this field). The tests that do not work well are the 'rapid tests' that attempt to detect antibodies in blood. You're better off flipping a coin.
David Stark 11
The problem is conflating screening tests with diagnostic tests and using them as if they were interchangeable.
Spin Wing 0
Exactly, David!
There has been an awful lot of “conflating” since this whole debacle started.


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