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FCC considers crackdown on bad wireless receivers after 5G/altimeter debacle

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The Federal Communications Commission will consider issuing new rules for wireless receivers that could prevent future conflicts like the ongoing battle between the aviation and cellular industries. There are strict rules requiring wireless devices to transmit only in their licensed frequencies. That means, for example, that AT&T and Verizon's 5G transmissions in C-band spectrum (3.7 to 3.98 GHz) have to stay within the C-band. But there isn't much to prevent devices from receiving… (arstechnica.com) और अधिक...

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cmuncy
Chris Muncy 8
This is probably the clearest and best represented article on what is going on w/ 5G and radar altimeters. As an electronics engineer, this article discusses a problem that has existed for decades. As the altimeters are pointed down to the earth, where there are a very limited number of C band transmitters, there was really, and in all sense, a finance reason, to engineer a very tight input rejection filter as the majority of the rF of C band was indeed coming from geosynchronous orbit and 180 degrees away from the radar altimeter antennas.
geharper
Gary Harper 6
I remember a time when the FCC was an enforcement agency that monitored radio transmissions and issued citations for out of band or over modulation. My job required me to be FCC licensed in order to work on the FCC licensed transmitters that our company used in their business. Not so much any more.
stansdds
Michael Stansfield 3
I remember when operating a CB radio required a license from the FCC. I also remember a whole lot of CB radio users were unlicensed. In fact, I think most were unlicensed.
linbb
linbb 3
Most of us were why bother to do so they didnt care at the time. They only cared if there was a specific problem somewhere. Talked face to face with one back then he said hell we dont care but its funny listing to the CB talk when we are in town about us.
ThinkingGuy
George Lane 2
Nowadays GMRS (General Mobile Radio Service) is the service that everyone uses without realizing they're supposed to have a license (and the radio vendors are happy to let that misconception persist)
djbaldwin
David Baldwin 1
Yes, early 1970's I was a licensed CB'er (KER7349), required to keep a log, 5 minutes on, 5 minutes off... Then the song and movie Convoy came out in 1978, and millions of unlicensed users clogged the airways. On good skip nights you could talk hundreds of miles away, but now you couldn't talk a mile. And as ThinkingGuy posted, it is starting on the GMRS Service (WRNB399) too. :-(
linbb
linbb 2
Hasnt been that many years ago when it was hard to have a very narrow band trans or receive. Today thats a different matter due to all the new tech that has come down the line. Now to replace all the old receivers in aircraft takes lots of money to do so.
cmuncy
Chris Muncy 5
In reality, it would be straight forwardto put an input bandpass filter on the antenna lead to the receiver, but getting both FAA and FCC type approval would be a totally different scenario.
dmboss1021
Dan Boss 4
There are pin heads in every discipline - electrical engineers are no exception. They may know lots about RF, but know almost nothing about avionics or the challenges associated with radio or radar altimeters.

It's not just harmonics as one post indicates, but also doppler effects! Duh that is how "doppler radar" detects wind speeds for weather forecasting! i.e. the frequency changes depending on the speed of the reflected waveforms! Planes are landing at 130-170 knots (150-196 MPH), and they are descending at roughly 750 feet per minute at the same time (8.52 MPH). Doppler effects demand that the radio altimeter has a wider band to accurately determine the height above the terrain.

Radar or radio altimeters are a key core part of the avionics system, and approval for new designs would take a decade or more. So all the arguments about newest and latest electronics has not taken these factors into account.

To make an analogy for the technically challenged, the radio altimeter is as critical to safety as the hydraulic/mechanical brakes on a passenger car. Now imagine what would happen if your car integrates some high tech fly by wire crap, which can override your braking command - and then imagine that the 5G signal could disrupt this fly by wire system and randomly cause your brakes to fail! You slam your foot on the pedal and the pedal goes to the floor without any braking action.

That is the potential of this folly. The blame is with the FCC and any and all pinheads who said it was OK to sell frequencies too close to the radio altimeter bands. Europe left a wider safety margin - and has no issues. We let asinine people create a serious safety conflict with greed, hubris and ignorance!
donhun1313
donhun1313 1
The doppler shift is so insignificant that it doesn't matter.

A transmitter operating at 4.5 GHz would only experience a doppler shift of 153 hertz at 1000 feet per second velocity.

Increase the velocity to 1000 feet per second (600 MPH or 52800 feet per minute) and the doppler shift is only 3.0 KHz.
donhun1313
donhun1313 1
Correction

Increase the velocity to 600 MPH or 52800 feet per minute and the doppler shift is only 8.07 KHz.
ExCalbr
Victor Engel 3
"Roberson said the current 400 MHz separation between altimeters and 5G "is very, very large," pointing out that the entire FM radio band is 20 MHz wide."

That's not how it works. Some of the most significant interference comes from harmonics.
kae0088
Ken Endacott 1
Comparing the radio altimeter band with the FM band is not relevant despite them having the same bandwidth. The FM band is 88MHz to 108MHz whereas the radio altimeter band is 4.2GHz to 4.4GHz where vastly different equipment design parameters apply.

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